Here comes the new Minsk Adventure Bike, nice!

Not accepting Chinese product is a mind set, I have been promoting Chinese made product in the Oil and Gas industry for over 15 years.
This industry has a huge emphasis on product reliability and safety, we were and still are very successful.
Initially there was a lot of hesitation to use Chinese products but showing high quality products to international standard and a big list of reference projects, this has changed a lot. Please note, this is a 100% owned Chinese company, no foreign influence and no so called European quality level image.

Certainly the Chinese motorcycles (and cars) are doing well in many countries outside of China, especially the developing markets.
Within China I have experienced that there is a preference to buy import rather than domestic, more and more this is a matter of "face" and has less to do with quality.

If Stallions/Shineray are going to do the Kougar 400R locally assembled in Thailand, I will order one provided the price is ok.
Maybe this will prove to be an error and the built quality shows to be awful but than at least I can comment from experience and not from a one-sided mindset.
 
Not accepting Chinese product is a mind set, I have been promoting Chinese made product in the Oil and Gas industry for over 15 years.
This industry has a huge emphasis on product reliability and safety, we were and still are very successful.
Initially there was a lot of hesitation to use Chinese products but showing high quality products to international standard and a big list of reference projects, this has changed a lot. Please note, this is a 100% owned Chinese company, no foreign influence and no so called European quality level image.

Certainly the Chinese motorcycles (and cars) are doing well in many countries outside of China, especially the developing markets.
Within China I have experienced that there is a preference to buy import rather than domestic, more and more this is a matter of "face" and has less to do with quality.

If Stallions/Shineray are going to do the Kougar 400R locally assembled in Thailand, I will order one provided the price is ok.
Maybe this will prove to be an error and the built quality shows to be awful but than at least I can comment from experience and not from a one-sided mindset.

I have to agree with brake034 in this case. If we were talking around 5 - 10 years ago, I would have the same mentality with most of the "I won't buy a crap Chinese Motorcycle" brigade. But lately, I would have to say reliability is up quite a bit. And I'm talking on a personal level.

Malaysia has a number of brands which re-assembles chinese bikes and quite a few of my friends own them. Brands like Demak, KTN, Nimota. I do have to report that their bikes has proven to be reliable for the past 3 years of knowing them. Plastics is the only issue that I find a bit wonky, as the plastics tend to fade within 1 or 2 years of having it. But that's easily painted over to have a fresh looking bike. In-terms of suspension and engine, since the chinese likes to copy - legally or illegally - japanese stuff, much of the replacement parts are interchangeable with jap bike parts. (I notice most parts are of Honda and Suzuki).

I have personally took a KTNS RS3 (which is the Zhongshen Rs3 re-assembled here) for a test ride. Engine is smooth, suspension is adequate, parts quality is okay. Reliability? well this bike has been on sale in Malaysia for the past 1 year and nary a complaint has been heard in the forums and rx3 groups. Just to address a discrepancy, this bike produces 18KW of power which is equivalent to 24-25HP which is not bad. My 2 grouse about this bike is the fact that it is carby and not EFI in Malaysia and the tyre size is odd (18" fronts and 15" rears).

The tricks that I have learnt from my chinese bike riding friends includes to do a full once over of all the bolts, fasteners, screws and what-nots on the bike upon purchase and once a year. Also, change to better fluids (oil, brake) and flush and re-fill the coolant system. Change chains to a better quality item and you are good to go. Including this cost into the initial purchase price still nets significant savings over a 'mainstream' bike.

-my worthless 2 cents
 
It's interesting to see that the lovers of Chinese fine machinery assume that people who stay away from Chinese bikes have no experience with Chinese-made products and are just haters.
Personally I have stayed away from Chinese products because I've seen how friends fared, and I have to say the facts were shocking. Bikes were literally falling apart on the ride home, electrics weren't working from the start or after the first trip in the rain, they were useless pices of junk which looked like ten years old after a couple of years and wouldn't start.
Personally I owned a Malaysian-made JRD 110 with electric start and disc brake. The price was a third lower than a comparable Honda and since it was made in Malaysia which produces its own cars I thought it couldn't be too bad. It looked great on the showroom floor and since I was adding it to my very limited fleet of my Coffee Shop rentals I thought it would be okay. But the front disc was grabby at slow speeds like a terrier and several times the rider went down and got introduced to road rash which ruined the vacation; no more beaches! Even I had a few close calls when the front wheel locked up. Then the rubber hoses started to deteriorate, the bike stank of gas and people got stranded somewhere in the boonies - try finding them! I had to take all the plastics off to get to the carb and tank and replace the hoses. After half a year the headlight gave up, rusted out, plastic started to fade, the speedo was hardly readable (it had a small red blinking light that said "Security" next to it but had no function at all) and the spokes were rusty. To make a long, sad story short, even the Malaysian-made bike didn't compare remotely to the refined, top quality Hondas. This bike gave me such a headache that I sold it after one year for a very low price, fortunately I didn't lose any money becase of the rental fees. And what I've heard from friends is that Chinese bikes even fared worse. I helped a friend to sell his two year old Platinum 175 which had one problem after the next and was now practically junk after only around 6,000km; nobody even replied to the ads, nobody wanted to pay only 10,000 baht for it! Resale value should be considered when seeing a real cheap Chinese-made product!
So I know what I'm talking about and have my reasons to stay away from non-Japanese bikes. I've heard it often: The Chinese are getting better, they are more reliable now, bla bla. But even brake034 seems to have his doubts: "Maybe this will prove to be an error and the built quality shows to be awful but than at least I can comment from experience and not from a one-sided mindset." Interestingly most owners of junk don't like to talk much about it or try to make things sound positive: "Well if you tighten all the nuts and bolts and if you fit some quality parts after they broke down and if you carry your cell phone and know a good mechanic who can pick up the bike - then it's not too bad!"
Personally motorcycles are more than transportation to me, they're more like a hobby and I am willing to pay a bit more for quality. And I know the Japanese deliver quality! They're not perfect but well worth the extra money. I want a decent bike that I can rely on, that starts, doesn't break down, I don't have to ride feeling "hopefully I'll make it home!"
My phone cost me 600 baht and was made in Korea; I buy cheap computers, microwaves and refrigerators, I don't care where they were made. I've owned BMW bikes but all in all I don't think they're worth the extra money; Hondas do just fine, especially here in Thailand. But when it comes to motorcycles which I enjoy riding I rather spend some extra money on a Japanese-made bike and know I've bought quality that has been developed over decades. I own more bikes than I really need and I'd always recommend to buy a used Honda or Yamaha for the same money a new Chinese bike costs. It'll probably run and look better than the Chinese product five years down the road!
But that's just me. If anybody wants to save money and buy a cheap Ching-Shong go ahead - try them out! Maybe they're perfect for you! :)
 
With 3 Chinese made bikes with over 80.000 km between the 3 , Thump is spot on with his opinion with Chinese made bikes, but the term I use is problematic.

But to be fair to 1 brand CF Moto is defiantly moving in the right direction IMO, and out of ALL the manufactories in China this is the only one I have hope for.


Now my Honda CRF 250L with over 18.000 km clocked up in 16 weeks is miles in front of all my other bikes.


But unlike you guys in Thailand we don't have the choice unless you don't mind paying very high import duties.


So most Chinese big bikes you see in China are illegal, take today had a ride out with 10 other bikes and mine was the only legal bike in the group.


Yes bikes are cheap and if you don't mind getting your hands dirty then buy a Chinese made bike and try and buy a CF Moto.


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What other people say about Chinese bikes

Source.....http://www.chinacarforums.com/china_auto/chinese_motorcycles_scooters.html




The Chinese motorcycle/motorbike/scooter industry has exploded in recent years. Manufacturers of these machines are producing an astounding number of motorcycles/motorbikes/scooters! The numbers are mind boggling. A recent report shows that Chinese motorcycle manufacturers are producing tons of machines annually. In fact, reports indicate that the numbers far more than 10 million per year and is growing quickly. What does all this mean?? Well, part of what it means is that Chinese motorcycles are beginning to flood worldwide markets. These days, it's possible to find these machines for sale at places that might surprise you. Have you headed down to your local auto parts store lately? Some of them are now selling these Chinese motorcycles. If you check eBay, you'll find that it seems that "everyone and his brother" is selling inexpensive Chinese motorcycles online!

One of the most confusing things about these motorcycles is the question about where are they from. It's not like the big Japanese manufacturers where there are a few big names and you know which company made your motorcycle. On the contrary, with these Chinese motorcycles, sometimes it can be hard to figure out exactly who made it and to get useful information on it's origin. There are so MANY different manufacturers producing these! Why does that matter? Well, it matters because not all these machines are made exactly the same way. The Chinese are masters at copying and so many of these bikes look basically the same. Even so, depending on the company that actually manufactured the bike, there can be some significant differenced in terms of quality and long term reliability. Needless to say, "cheaper is not always better"! The old saying, "you get what you pay for" also has some relevance in terms of Chinese motorcycles, but the fact is that one of the biggest advantages of these machines is that they offer a lot for a little bit of money. You can buy a Chinese motorcycle for a fraction of the cost of a name brand Japanese bike! For someone on a limited budget, this can be a big deciding factor! It is possible to buy a nice, brand new Chinese motorcycle for much less than an old, used Japanese bike!

Another big question you should ask yourself while shopping for Chinese motorcycles/motorbikes/scooters (whether it be online or in person), is regarding parts supply. This is a big one! You need to make sure that whatever you buy will have parts accessible in the future so that you can repair & maintain your Chinese motorcycle and keep it going. It doesn't matter how cheap the initial purchase was if later your motorcycle becomes inoperable because you can not get a simple $5 repair part! Don't just take the word of the seller. Try to get proof that parts will be available for any Chinese motorcycles that you are considering to purchase. Do your homework and research the manufacturer. Fortunately, many of these Chinese motorcycles are copied heavily from Japanese designs, so it may be possible to get engine parts and others from one of the big Japanese dealers, but just be sure to question the sources of parts so you can be better assured that your motorcycle will be able to serve you for many years to come.

Some people may be a bit apprehensive regarding these low cost Chinese motorcycles/motorbikes/scooters. In some ways, it is similar to the early years of Japanese vehicles in the US. Initially, some people were skeptical and critical of those machines - with good reason. Some of the products were a bit questionable early on and with no track record, how could anyone know for sure what to expect. Well, as it turned out, the Japanese motorcycle industry exploded and has proven itself well over decades of producing great products. The Chinese motorcycle manufacturers seem to be in the early stages of a similar business model. Time will tell for sure, but the writing on the wall is clear... the Chinese are a formidable worldwide force in the production of motorcycles! So, the next time you see one of these machines, take a closer look. You might be surprised at the high quality and low price that you see!
 
"Some people may be a bit apprehensive regarding these low cost Chinese motorcycles/motorbikes/scooters. In some ways, it is similar to the early years of Japanese vehicles in the US. Initially, some people were skeptical and critical of those machines - with good reason. Some of the products were a bit questionable early on and with no track record, how could anyone know for sure what to expect. Well, as it turned out, the Japanese motorcycle industry exploded and has proven itself well over decades of producing great products. The Chinese motorcycle manufacturers seem to be in the early stages of a similar business model. Time will tell for sure, but the writing on the wall is clear... the Chinese are a formidable worldwide force in the production of motorcycles! So, the next time you see one of these machines, take a closer look. You might be surprised at the high quality and low price that you see!"

If you've ever dealt with Japanese and Chinese people or if you have visited or lived in those countries you should know that even though both countries are part of Asia about everything else is almost the opposite. To assume that the Chinese will develop in the same way the Japanese did is a big mistake.
In my opinion the Chinese will need at least half a century to even come close to Japanese quality which is a product of attitude, intelligence, diligence and much more which the Chinese simply do not possess. It's like saying: "If Great Britain can produce cars like Rolls Royce and Jaguar then Belgium can't be far behind since it's also a country in Europe. Just give them a few years."
 
Thump, what's a JRD 110? I've never heard of it.

In any case, I'm just saying what i have noticed in the recent years. You are entitled to your opinions. And i'm sorry about your JRD. Just to be clear, i dont own a chinese bike and certainly aint calling you 'hater'.

That said, what you said about belgium and the uk in reference to the chinese and jap does not hold water as the belgians are certainly not building anything remotely close to a rolls or a bentley. I think it would be a better reference between uk and germany. Once the germans were also trying to get into the luxury car game. First few outing was not really good... Forward a few years and the phaeton came out... Forward another few years the german bought over rolls and bentley...

Same thing with the chinese and the japs. Same game, probably the same outcome in 10 years or so. Benelli is now owned by the chinese....

Just remember the vaunted i-phone is made in china. IBM majority shares are owned by Lenovo, a chinese company. Saying they don't have the attitude, the quality controls and th skills to go global is really just a mind set and not refleftive of the current world economy.
 
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In my opinion the Chinese will need at least half a century to even come close to Japanese quality

Need to take the "0" off

Only 30 years ago ....
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1985
1 January The first British mobile phone call is made (by Ernie Wise to Vodafone).

we have only had over 250cc bikes made in China for the last 4 years and the most years i can find a person who has held a Chinese DL is only 25 years
 
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