50/50 Tyres for Africa Twin RD07 (F 90/90-21 R 140/80-17)

[Fabiano Nero]

Hello,

I read interesting older posts about tyre models in Bangkok but I thought I'd start a new thread to update these with a focus on the sort of tyre I am looking for (see subject). I have been using Conti Escape's on my AT (rated 70/30 on/off) but I need a better on/off-road balance for use here in Cambodia (where you can't get anywhere interesting without a good portion of off-road including due to permanent road-works everywhere in the country, which in the rainy season means a lot of mud, besides wet pavements...).

It seems availability of such tyres has narrowed since the earlier posts here:
- Piroj only has the Mich T63 on offer (of which the R does not fit the RD07 but I read good things about the F which does fit),
- Pirelli has the MT 60 on offer (60/40 though, perhaps an option as a R),
- 29tire and a guy calledTirapong both only have Karoo 3’s on offer (70/30 though)
- I just located the Heidenau dealer who I hope will have the K60 as a R option (but which has bad reviews in wet and mud).

I was so far unable to locate a supplier for:
- Dunlop (D605 or 606)
- Mitas (E07)
- Kenda (270)
- Conti (TKC80)
while IRC though made in Thailand does not seem to have a (R) tyre of that size and profile...

Your advice is very welcome:
- either addresses (preferably email or FB so I can contact easily from Phnom Penh) of suppliers of the missing tyres above
- and/or suggestions for other matching tyre models and their suppliers in BKK (e.g. I hear about MAXXIS which I know nothing about...)
- and/or your best advice on the best combination of the models I found so far

Many thanks !
FN (Phnom Penh)

 

[bsacbob]

Welcome to Ride Asia, i fitted some Karro 3 tyres to the BMW X Country and found them to be great on road tyres although expect i little drumming while riding tarmac as for off road only did dry dirt and found they worked pretty well. Mixed reviews on the internet as to their off road capabilities but equal to the TKC 80 i would say.

 

[Fabiano Nero]

Thanks Bob ! So, considering the silence: no D606s, TKC80s or E07s in Thailand (anymore) ? Sigh...

 

[CraigBKK]

Thanks Bob ! So, considering the silence: no D606s, TKC80s or E07s in Thailand (anymore) ? Sigh...

Hmmmm, that's a sad state of affairs... I emailed Piroj yesterday about prices of the T63 to fit a CRF 250L but have heard nothing yet. I thought Klaus was riding with those Dunlops, maybe he can answer...

 

[schrauberklaus]

Hi Craig

The Tires on my CRF are the 605 NOT 606 .
The 605 are no Problem to get in Bangkok , just get 2 new set .

But i think the Rear in 3.60 / 18 will not fit the AT ,to small and no R and if i remember correct the AT is 17" on the Rear Tire .

But the Metzler Sahara 3 Enduro is available in Bangkok and that will fit . 120,130,140/17
I use them on my XL in 140/17 for years without Problems . R or S i don't know .
I drive seldom over 150 but have no Tire Problems if i go faster .

 

[Fabiano Nero]

Thanks guys !
1) Klaus:
- Can you give me the Dunlop address in BKK ? Maybe they can get D606 for me too ?
- Since I found a Metzeler dealer I was guessing he will have the Sahara Enduro 3 as well as the Karoo 3 but from what I read and see it seems to be mainly a 'dry' off-roader (very tight blocks) and overall barely more off-road than the Karoo 3 ?
2) Craig:
Pairoj quoted the prices below for T63 2 days ago (surely not your sizes). I would love to go ahead with them as they seem to have what I need for the coming months: reliable on wet surface and as good as 50/50s get in mud. I am hesitant about the 130 width though: below the recommended 140 for the RD07 and quite narrow esp. on wet pavement under a 230 kg bike + 100 kilo pilot/load ?... Michelin advertizes them for 'mid-sized trail bikes i.e. that is not the AT...
90/90-212600 Baht.
130/80-17 2850 Baht.
3) Anybody: since Pirelli is present in BKK i was thinking of buying a set of Scorpion Rally. F size ok, R however too big and thin at 150-17. Does anybody think that is going to be a problem (RD07 rear rim is 3" which is outside the theoretical range for 150mm tyres as the chart here shows: Rim to Tyre Application Chart ?........

 

[CraigBKK]

Thanks guys !
1) Klaus:
- Can you give me the Dunlop address in BKK ? Maybe they can get D606 for me too ?
- Since I found a Metzeler dealer I was guessing he will have the Sahara Enduro 3 as well as the Karoo 3 but from what I read and see it seems to be mainly a 'dry' off-roader (very tight blocks) and overall barely more off-road than the Karoo 3 ?
2) Craig:
Pairoj quoted the prices below for T63 2 days ago (surely not your sizes). I would love to go ahead with them as they seem to have what I need for the coming months: reliable on wet surface and as good as 50/50s get in mud. I am hesitant about the 130 width though: below the recommended 140 for the RD07 and quite narrow esp. on wet pavement under a 230 kg bike + 100 kilo pilot/load ?... Michelin advertizes them for 'mid-sized trail bikes i.e. that is not the AT...
90/90-212600 Baht.
130/80-17 2850 Baht.
3) Anybody: since Pirelli is present in BKK i was thinking of buying a set of Scorpion Rally. F size ok, R however too big and thin at 150-17. Does anybody think that is going to be a problem (RD07 rear rim is 3" which is outside the theoretical range for 150mm tyres as the chart here shows: Rim to Tyre Application Chart ?........

I live close to the Pirelli shop in On Nut. I was in there asking about the Scorpion Rallycross mt21 tyres a few months ago in sizes 90/90 21" and 120/80 18" for the CRF, they had the front tyre but only the rear in 130/80, which would have made this already tall bike a little taller so I didn't buy the pair. Price for the pair was around 5,300THB.

 

[Fabiano Nero]

Thanks Craig, I would not use the MT21 on a big bike with 50% pavement anyways and now Pirelli (after I insisted...) that mounting a 150 tyre on a 3"rim is not a wise idea.
Klaus, can you tell me where you bought the D605 so I can try fo a 606 there ?...
Any ideas on the 130 R tyre on the AT when a 140 is recommended ?...

 

[brake034]

Fabiano, did you consider the Heidenau K60 Scout set: Reifenwerk Heidenau
If needed I can give you a contact at Heidenau Singapore, they seem to stock more than Heidenau Thailand.

 

[Fabiano Nero]

Thanks guys ! I am really looking for something that behaves well on wet pavement and in wet dirt (which makes me exclude the K60 and the Karoo 3 but maybe I am too much influenced by pro rider reports ?...) so considering the supply right now in BKK I am down to:
1) Front: Mich T63 or Pirelli Scorpion Rally (with the first cheaper and supposedly better on-road incl. wet ?)
2) Rear: one too thin, the other too wide (recommended is 140/80)
- Mich T63 comes in 130/80 and with a lower load/speed index: how will this work out e.g. on wet pavement under a 230 kg bike + 100 kilo pilot/load ? Michelin advertizes them for 'mid-sized trail bikes i.e. not the AT...
- Pirelli Scorpion Rally comes in 150-17: how would this work ?Is there a risk that the tyre comes off the rim ? I read quite some reports of AT riders shoeing this size without problems but the charts clearly show that a 3" rim is outside the range for 150mm tyres...

 

[schrauberklaus]

I need first to get in contact with a friend .
Depend my Thai sucks i let him always call the Tire Shops and i don't have the number .

 

[Fabiano Nero]

:-) Klaus. I was told by tire29 that they only have Dunlop 605, not 606 right now.
I think I will go with Pirelly Scorpion Rally F and Mich T63 R, I can't imagine these 150/17s fitting and behaving well on a 3"rim...
Unless somebody knows where to find Shinko 804/805 Big Blocks in BKK ? :-)

- - - Updated - - -

:-) Klaus. I was told by tire29 that they only have Dunlop 605, not 606 right now.
I think I will go with Pirelly Scorpion Rally F and Mich T63 R, I can't imagine these 150/17s fitting and behaving well on a 3"rim...
Unless somebody knows where to find Shinko 804/805 Big Blocks in BKK ? :-)

 

[schrauberklaus]

Got the Infos .
Shops name : Damlong Tel : 02223789

And the D605 are 4.60 thats about 120-130 but the Load Index is not high enough for the AT.

The D606 in size 130/90-17R has a load index of 68 thats 315kg . On a AT with a 100kg Driver already max. But Tires with Load Index 68/69 had Hondas Tyre approval according to my List .

The T63 in 130/80 17 has a Load Index of 65 means max.290 kg

The K60 in 130 and 140 or bigger have a different Profile , guess the 130 is better in Mud but Load Index 65 , the 140 has 69

What you are looking for Mud , Road , on a heavy Bike , with knobbys maybe the best compromise is the TKC 80

Or you go more Off Road with something like the Metzler Unicross , a Street legal Motocross tire with a Load Index of 70
But then you can forget the Higher speeds on Streets and not shure you get it in 17"

Also take a look at Pirellis MT21 Rally Cross in 130/90-17 68 P fit all your need except Speed .

 

[Fabiano Nero]

Vielen Dank Klaus !
Does Damlong have all those brands (Dunlop, Conti, Mich) ?...
Do you think there is danger in exceeding the load index a bit ? I was thinking the weight is shared over 2 tyres so e.g. a T63 could carry a loaded AT (max 330 kg) ? I do read reports of ATs using them but perhaps not loaded... and then there are these gorgeous photos and good reviews of a KLR650 on T63's :-) https://klr650blog.wordpress.com/ ....

 

[Fabiano Nero]

PS Klaus can you pls check Damlong's no. again ? seems there is 1 digit missing thanks !

 

[Lone Rider]

Maybe this helps:

Dumrong Yangyont (Pure Motorsport) (Ek Paiboon)

453 Maitreejit Road WongWean 22 Promprab Bangkok 10100
newshop 282-284 old shop across
Tel. 02-222 3789,223-8214,221 4726,6232042
Fax: 02-2263806 Mobile 081-621 6663

 

[Fabiano Nero]

Yes sir it does thanks ! In fact this is the same shop where a certain Tirapong is active, reachable also via email tirapong7@yahoo.com. But only has Karoo 3 right now. definitely seems the choices have narrowed down over the last years (no market ?). Same here in Phnom Penh.
So any advice on what to expect when riding a R tyre with a load index of 65S instead of the recommended 69H (difference in max load = 35 kg) ?
In any case there is a contradiction between what Honda advises as R tyre for the Africa Twin RD07a (140-90) and the tyre brands since the latter all prefer a 3.50"rim for the 140 tyre whereas the AT has a 3"rim. Given also that the front tyre will be in line with recommended load index , I am tempted to take the risk though a 130 tyre will look thinnish on an AT and perhaps feel less stable on pavement too...

 

[Fabiano Nero]

OK said Tirapong now offers a set of TKC80 in the appropriate size incl. for R (140/80) but as you know at almost twice the price of the T63 :-) (6600 thb vs 10900 thb).
My wallet says: go for the T63 or at least a F T63 and a R TKC80 (only 50$ saving on the F though); intuition says the bigger TKC 80 will suit the heavy bikes better even though (cardinal point for me) T63 has a better wet pavement and mud reputation.
It is really annoying that most commenters on all fora don't mention their bikes ! Everybody loves the T63 but how many among ride 230 wet weight bikes + 100 for load ?.......

 

[CraigBKK]

OK said Tirapong now offers a set of TKC80 in the appropriate size incl. for R (140/80) but as you know at almost twice the price of the T63 :-) (6600 thb vs 10900 thb).
My wallet says: go for the T63 or at least a F T63 and a R TKC80 (only 50$ saving on the F though); intuition says the bigger TKC 80 will suit the heavy bikes better even though (cardinal point for me) T63 has a better wet pavement and mud reputation.
It is really annoying that most commenters on all fora don't mention their bikes ! Everybody loves the T63 but how many among ride 230 wet weight bikes + 100 for load ?.......

If there is any doubt over the load index, which as far as I understand is a safety feature, I would err on the side of caution. Why take a risk to save yourself ฿4,300?

 

[Fabiano Nero]

I agree Craig. Been reading too many US threads on advrider where they haggle over 5$ :-) :-)

 

[Fabiano Nero]

PS if am not mistaken that is a set of TKC80s i see on Ride Asia's b&w 'profile' photo above, at least the rear ? :-)

 

[schrauberklaus]

Sorry was a few days of the Net , ride my CRF to Ayuttaya .

Guess the question about Damlangs Phone number is answered already .

About TKC80 Profile i can tell you that the Front Tire Profile is totaly different to the Rear in the Size you need .
Guess 90/90 21 , if you see that Front Tire you will never guess its a TKC80
Why i know , i have a set 90/90 21 and 140/17 try it on my XL , don't like it and change back to the Sahara 3 after a few 100 km .
Maybe it was the Tire maybe the XL , i give the Tires (at leased the Rear ) a try on another Bike , just got a XR 400 Motard.

 

[Fabiano Nero]

I want to thank you all for your advice and information. I finally took the (expensive) TKC80 offer from Mr T (Thirapong) who shipped them to Chanthaburi where I went to pick them up when I was in Koh Kong S-Cambodia. These tyres finally make me understand the Adventure in Africa Twin: on dry dirt it now behaves like or better than a Baja :-). On concrete it does have surprising rear wheel slips as other users have been reporting all over the forums - I need to test more to understand what is causing these... In fact I now feel more comfee on my bike off- than on-road :-)

Meanwhile I wanted to share the fun I had on a rural trail yesterday :-) (the video quality is much better in the original, I guess FB compresses it for uploading sorry...)

[video]https://www.facebook.com/fabiano.nero.92/videos/10152928384166918/ [/video]

 

[Forest]

130 is the width Craig,does not make the bike taller.better traction.preaty good tires I may say ,as I am shopping around for a set....

I live close to the Pirelli shop in On Nut. I was in there asking about the Scorpion Rallycross mt21 tyres a few months ago in sizes 90/90 21" and 120/80 18" for the CRF, they had the front tyre but only the rear in 130/80, which would have made this already tall bike a little taller so I didn't buy the pair. Price for the pair was around 5,300THB.

 

[CraigBKK]

130 is the width Craig,does not make the bike taller.better traction.preaty good tires I may say ,as I am shopping around for a set....

But I thought the ratio of height to width (80) would make the bike taller, 80% of 130 being greater than 80% of 120, or have I totally misunderstood it - quite probably :?

From on reviews I read it is a good tyre. Only negative was the longevity.

 

[Forest]

But I thought the ratio of height to width (80) would make the bike taller, 80% of 130 being greater than 80% of 120, or have I totally misunderstood it - quite probably :?

From on reviews I read it is a good tyre. Only negative was the longevity.

but ur right too.it is a bit taller ..but thats only a few mm.not enough for me to compromise choice

 

[brake034]

A bit late but I have found a source for Mitas (E-07) tires in Asia, if interested let me know.

 

[Fabiano Nero]

A bit late but I have found a source for Mitas (E-07) tires in Asia, if interested let me know.

Dear all, a few years and tyres later (incl a Pirelli Scorpion front and a useless Shinko rear) I have done 5000 km with a Mitas 07 rear and there is more than 50% of it left even at a lowly 1.5bar and 40% offroad, added the same front (Dakar) after the Pirelli died and the combination is perfect on and off, first time since the TKC80s that I can push the bike to my own limits again :-) Source 29tire facebook.com/29tire

 

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